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J-Mi
This is my second topic before I go to work. Does anyone think they should bring back capital punishment in this country? Why?
psychÝ
QUOTE(Politics and World issues board Guidelines)
If you copy and paste an article from a news source or other location then you must provide your own comment which provides significant contribution to the thread along with it. If you do not your post may be deleted and repeated offences will result in a ban from the political boards.

Without a person's opinion or reaction to the artice that they're posting, they're just spamming. I could go to CNN.com and grab all the headlines, post them here, and watch my post count rise. It's just copy and pasting. If I wanted news, I would go to a news site to get it
J-Mi
QUOTE(psychÝ @ Apr 1 2008, 06:53 AM) [snapback]1403935[/snapback]
QUOTE(Politics and World issues board Guidelines)
If you copy and paste an article from a news source or other location then you must provide your own comment which provides significant contribution to the thread along with it. If you do not your post may be deleted and repeated offences will result in a ban from the political boards.

Without a person's opinion or reaction to the artice that they're posting, they're just spamming. I could go to CNN.com and grab all the headlines, post them here, and watch my post count rise. It's just copy and pasting. If I wanted news, I would go to a news site to get it



what's that got to do with it?
Severus Snape
QUOTE(J-Mi @ Apr 1 2008, 01:03 AM) [snapback]1403938[/snapback]
QUOTE(psychÝ @ Apr 1 2008, 06:53 AM) [snapback]1403935[/snapback]
QUOTE(Politics and World issues board Guidelines)
If you copy and paste an article from a news source or other location then you must provide your own comment which provides significant contribution to the thread along with it. If you do not your post may be deleted and repeated offences will result in a ban from the political boards.

Without a person's opinion or reaction to the artice that they're posting, they're just spamming. I could go to CNN.com and grab all the headlines, post them here, and watch my post count rise. It's just copy and pasting. If I wanted news, I would go to a news site to get it



what's that got to do with it?

Everything. You can't just post a topic without giving your own opinion on the subject. According to your own post when you started this topic:

QUOTE
This is my second topic before I go to work. Does anyone think they should bring back capital punishment in this country? Why?


Your second topic. And none of your opinions on the subject. All you did was just ask if people think they should bring back capital punishment in the UK. How do YOU feel about it? What are YOUR thoughts?

Personally - I think capital punishment should be allowed in ALL countries. Not for stealing, or anything lame. But if you are found guilty of a heinous crime (murder 1, surprise sex 1, treason, etc.) you should have your flame extinguished. And yes - if I was facing the death penalty for something I did then I would suck it up and just go with it. I am not immune from the law, even if I break it intentionally.
gingergenius
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 1 2008, 01:05 PM) [snapback]1403994[/snapback]
QUOTE(J-Mi @ Apr 1 2008, 01:03 AM) [snapback]1403938[/snapback]
QUOTE(psychÝ @ Apr 1 2008, 06:53 AM) [snapback]1403935[/snapback]
QUOTE(Politics and World issues board Guidelines)
If you copy and paste an article from a news source or other location then you must provide your own comment which provides significant contribution to the thread along with it. If you do not your post may be deleted and repeated offences will result in a ban from the political boards.

Without a person's opinion or reaction to the artice that they're posting, they're just spamming. I could go to CNN.com and grab all the headlines, post them here, and watch my post count rise. It's just copy and pasting. If I wanted news, I would go to a news site to get it



what's that got to do with it?

Everything. You can't just post a topic without giving your own opinion on the subject. According to your own post when you started this topic:

QUOTE
This is my second topic before I go to work. Does anyone think they should bring back capital punishment in this country? Why?
Your second topic. And none of your opinions on the subject. All you did was just ask if people think they should bring back capital punishment in the UK. How do YOU feel about it? What are YOUR thoughts?

Personally - I think capital punishment should be allowed in ALL countries. Not for stealing, or anything lame. But if you are found guilty of a heinous crime (murder 1, surprise sex 1, treason, etc.) you should have your flame extinguished. And yes - if I was facing the death penalty for something I did then I would suck it up and just go with it. I am not immune from the law, even if I break it intentionally.


you say that now....

ok I'll bring up the argument that is blindingly obvious to bring up: what if the justice system is wrong? you can't get early release and compensation if you're dead.

other than this, look at Tookie Williams. A murderer, gangster and all of the rest. A nasty piece of work when he went on trial and thoroughly deserving of a long prison sentence. While waiting on death row, he not only repents but goes about actively trying to undo the wrongs of his past, writing books against gangsterism etc. Tookie Williams on the day of his death was a benefit to society. But he was still executed. Why?

A lot of murderers commit their crime when they're young. So they go to jail where they miss their best years, they have to live with dangerous people and they have no sex unless they're gay. They won't get out until they're at least middle aged, by which time they'll have missed the chance to either have a family or see it grow up. Long stretches in prison aren't simply opportunities to have a laugh with some bad boys, have fun escape ruses and educate yourself and work out a lot. They define the life of the prisoner. That's punishment enough, especially given the fact that death itself is a serious consideration for prisoners; look at prison suicide rates.

I agree there is a good case for capital punishment, but if you weigh up the facts then it's a really unworkable policy. It is morally and ethically unacceptable.
BIG FUCKING SPIDER
Tookie Williams was a piece of shit, he killed innocent people, help set up one of the worse Gangs in America, who cares if he "repented" by telling people not do what he did, he was still a murderer and deserved the Punishment he was given.
Severus Snape
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
you say that now....

ok I'll bring up the argument that is blindingly obvious to bring up: what if the justice system is wrong? you can't get early release and compensation if you're dead.

No system is perfect, mistakes are going to be made. But you also cannot forget to use the rules that are in place just because you fear that a mistake may be made. That's exactly what has happened to the US lately - too many people afraid they'll screw something up, so let's not use the rules we have. And if you can't pay the price, then you shouldn't play the game.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
other than this, look at Tookie Williams. A murderer, gangster and all of the rest. A nasty piece of work when he went on trial and thoroughly deserving of a long prison sentence. While waiting on death row, he not only repents but goes about actively trying to undo the wrongs of his past, writing books against gangsterism etc. Tookie Williams on the day of his death was a benefit to society. But he was still executed. Why?

He was executed because he broke the law, and death was his penalty. Are you saying he should have been set free because he says he's sorry? That's a legal precedent that you don't want to start. Why? Because then everyone who commits a crime will have to be set free on the basis of "I'm sorry. I repented and should be forgiven for my crime, no matter how heinous."

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
A lot of murderers commit their crime when they're young. So they go to jail where they miss their best years, they have to live with dangerous people...

(I'm not dismissing the last portion - just leaving it out.) So what? If they screw up young, they miss the best years. Nobody complains when a retired person commits a crime and then misses retirement because they are incarcerated. Too bad. If you screw up, you pay. Doesn't matter when you screw up.

And it's not like they don't know what will happen to them if they break the law. We aren't hiding the consequences from these people.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
They won't get out until they're at least middle aged, by which time they'll have missed the chance to either have a family or see it grow up.

They shouldn't have broke the law, then. Boo fricking hoo.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
Long stretches in prison aren't simply opportunities to have a laugh with some bad boys, have fun escape ruses and educate yourself and work out a lot. They define the life of the prisoner.

Again, boo hoo. My heart bleeds peanut butter and jelly sandwiches for guys that fuck up and have to spend their entire lives behind bars. Someone call the wahmbulance.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
That's punishment enough, especially given the fact that death itself is a serious consideration for prisoners; look at prison suicide rates.

IMHO, not punishment enough. Bring back chain gangs. Put them to work. Enough lazing around smoking and doing push ups.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
I agree there is a good case for capital punishment, but if you weigh up the facts then it's a really unworkable policy. It is morally and ethically unacceptable.

You contradict yourself here. First there's a case for it, then you're against it. Which side of that fence did you say you were on?
Ulster_Niko
Prison should be a tough punishment but nowadays it simply isn't. Prisoners live in relative comfort. Yes, they do not get to see families, women, freedom etc but watching TV, working out is hardly an apt punishment for people who commit crimes of such magnitudes such as murder, rape, paedophilia etc. The most laughable evidence of the prison justice system failing is the young offenders institutes they now have. Some of the little fuck ups intentionally reoffend so they can play the Playstation again, and live a more comfortable life than they do at home.
gingergenius
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 1 2008, 05:21 PM) [snapback]1404055[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
you say that now....

ok I'll bring up the argument that is blindingly obvious to bring up: what if the justice system is wrong? you can't get early release and compensation if you're dead.

No system is perfect, mistakes are going to be made. But you also cannot forget to use the rules that are in place just because you fear that a mistake may be made. That's exactly what has happened to the US lately - too many people afraid they'll screw something up, so let's not use the rules we have. And if you can't pay the price, then you shouldn't play the game.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
other than this, look at Tookie Williams. A murderer, gangster and all of the rest. A nasty piece of work when he went on trial and thoroughly deserving of a long prison sentence. While waiting on death row, he not only repents but goes about actively trying to undo the wrongs of his past, writing books against gangsterism etc. Tookie Williams on the day of his death was a benefit to society. But he was still executed. Why?

He was executed because he broke the law, and death was his penalty. Are you saying he should have been set free because he says he's sorry? That's a legal precedent that you don't want to start. Why? Because then everyone who commits a crime will have to be set free on the basis of "I'm sorry. I repented and should be forgiven for my crime, no matter how heinous."

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
A lot of murderers commit their crime when they're young. So they go to jail where they miss their best years, they have to live with dangerous people...

(I'm not dismissing the last portion - just leaving it out.) So what? If they screw up young, they miss the best years. Nobody complains when a retired person commits a crime and then misses retirement because they are incarcerated. Too bad. If you screw up, you pay. Doesn't matter when you screw up.

And it's not like they don't know what will happen to them if they break the law. We aren't hiding the consequences from these people.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
They won't get out until they're at least middle aged, by which time they'll have missed the chance to either have a family or see it grow up.

They shouldn't have broke the law, then. Boo fricking hoo.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
Long stretches in prison aren't simply opportunities to have a laugh with some bad boys, have fun escape ruses and educate yourself and work out a lot. They define the life of the prisoner.

Again, boo hoo. My heart bleeds peanut butter and jelly sandwiches for guys that fuck up and have to spend their entire lives behind bars. Someone call the wahmbulance.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
That's punishment enough, especially given the fact that death itself is a serious consideration for prisoners; look at prison suicide rates.

IMHO, not punishment enough. Bring back chain gangs. Put them to work. Enough lazing around smoking and doing push ups.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
I agree there is a good case for capital punishment, but if you weigh up the facts then it's a really unworkable policy. It is morally and ethically unacceptable.

You contradict yourself here. First there's a case for it, then you're against it. Which side of that fence did you say you were on?


Get some rhetorical skill.

You've spent time here going through my argument and analysing it. Good boy. Unfortunately you waste your time by being black & white (I never said you had to release Tookie Williams, just not to execute him); being presumptuous (by assuming me saying life imprisonment was a bad punishment means I think they're being punished too harshly); and then by being black and white again (there can be a good case for an argument without it being correct).

Apart from that, I'd challenge you to go to a prison and see how you like it. What with prison gangs, sexually frustrated men, a high concentration of people with few moral scruples and psychiatric problems, and all the rest I'm sure you'd love it. If you get a life sentence then you're looking at the majority of your life in a hellish environment. The only point in life is to enjoy yourself and make the most of it; if you've got the rest of your life being bullied, abused etc. then you might like to end it a bit sooner than it would anyway and spare yourself some pain...
J-Mi
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 1 2008, 01:05 PM) [snapback]1403994[/snapback]
QUOTE(J-Mi @ Apr 1 2008, 01:03 AM) [snapback]1403938[/snapback]
QUOTE(psychÝ @ Apr 1 2008, 06:53 AM) [snapback]1403935[/snapback]
QUOTE(Politics and World issues board Guidelines)
If you copy and paste an article from a news source or other location then you must provide your own comment which provides significant contribution to the thread along with it. If you do not your post may be deleted and repeated offences will result in a ban from the political boards.

Without a person's opinion or reaction to the artice that they're posting, they're just spamming. I could go to CNN.com and grab all the headlines, post them here, and watch my post count rise. It's just copy and pasting. If I wanted news, I would go to a news site to get it



what's that got to do with it?

Everything. You can't just post a topic without giving your own opinion on the subject. According to your own post when you started this topic:

QUOTE
This is my second topic before I go to work. Does anyone think they should bring back capital punishment in this country? Why?
Your second topic. And none of your opinions on the subject. All you did was just ask if people think they should bring back capital punishment in the UK. How do YOU feel about it? What are YOUR thoughts?

Personally - I think capital punishment should be allowed in ALL countries. Not for stealing, or anything lame. But if you are found guilty of a heinous crime (murder 1, surprise sex 1, treason, etc.) you should have your flame extinguished. And yes - if I was facing the death penalty for something I did then I would suck it up and just go with it. I am not immune from the law, even if I break it intentionally.


yea, sorry mate. im new. But I said it in the context that I think they should bring it back, because for the past 40 odd years or so nothing else has really worked at all.
Mekstizzle
Bring it back, but only for the worst crimes.
Severus Snape
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 12:41 PM) [snapback]1404110[/snapback]
Get some rhetorical skill.

You've spent time here going through my argument and analysing it. Good boy. Unfortunately you waste your time by being black & white (I never said you had to release Tookie Williams, just not to execute him); being presumptuous (by assuming me saying life imprisonment was a bad punishment means I think they're being punished too harshly); and then by being black and white again (there can be a good case for an argument without it being correct).

Apart from that, I'd challenge you to go to a prison and see how you like it. What with prison gangs, sexually frustrated men, a high concentration of people with few moral scruples and psychiatric problems, and all the rest I'm sure you'd love it. If you get a life sentence then you're looking at the majority of your life in a hellish environment. The only point in life is to enjoy yourself and make the most of it; if you've got the rest of your life being bullied, abused etc. then you might like to end it a bit sooner than it would anyway and spare yourself some pain...

When it comes to punishment for breaking the law, it can only ever be black and white. You either accept your sentence or you don't. I am not saying that prisoners have to accept what they are in for in the prison system. I am only stating that they broke the law, they received a sentence, and like it or not they have to serve it. Even if that means being put to death.

Would I like prison? Hell no. I don't need to go to one to know it would suck. But if people don't want to go to prison, then they shouldn't fuck up. It's that simple. Don't fuck up and you won't go to prison. We aren't hiding the consequences from people. You know what happens if you kill someone. You go to jail, and in some states you face the silver, hollow sliver. People know that. If they don't want to face a life of abuse, bullies, etc., then don't kill/rob/torture/etc. someone.

As far as someone repenting and not having to die - did they think about that BEFORE they took someone else's life? Did Tookie, before he killed an innocent person, think "Geez - this person doesn't deserve to die. Maybe I shouldn't do this"? Probably not. If he had, then he wouldn't have killed this person. But he killed. And repenting won't get you anywhere with the state - especially if you show no remorse during your trial. And the jury saw fit to sentence him to death for his crimes. The fact that he repented and said he was sorry doesn't lessen his sentence, or take away from what he did. His punishment in this case was death. If he didn't like it, he could have gone through the proper appeals and such in an attempt to have his sentence reduced.

Again, by your logic someone who gets sentenced should be let off early and easy for saying "Oops - I made a mistake. Forgive me?". You're barking up the wrong tree with that argument, gigi. Let's put this into a perspective that you understand: Say, for example, YOU shoplifted something. (I'm not saying you did, this is a hypothetical situation). You get caught, and you are sentenced to 40 hours of community service. And your community service (you find out later) happens to be something that you absolutely hate and will scar you if you are forced to do it (I don't know what that is, so pick something you can't stand to do). At the same time, someone you know gets busted for shoplifting and gets 40 hours of community service. But this person says they are sorry, and that they should be forgiven, so they get let off with only doing 5 hours. Pissed yet? Cuz you would be seeing as you both got the same sentence for the same crime, but one of you got off early for saying "My bad!". Now apply this same logic to prisoners on death row.

Would you be willing to set that legal precedent? Would you be willing to look one prisoner in the eye and tell them their sentence is reduced for saying sorry, knowing full well that every prisoner out there in America (or wherever) will now be asking to be set free early because they are sorry too? Once you set the precedent, you can't take it back. Every prisoner now gets to go free for saying they were wrong.

Thoughts?
psychÝ
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 1 2008, 05:21 PM) [snapback]1404055[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
you say that now....

ok I'll bring up the argument that is blindingly obvious to bring up: what if the justice system is wrong? you can't get early release and compensation if you're dead.

No system is perfect, mistakes are going to be made. But you also cannot forget to use the rules that are in place just because you fear that a mistake may be made. That's exactly what has happened to the US lately - too many people afraid they'll screw something up, so let's not use the rules we have. And if you can't pay the price, then you shouldn't play the game.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
other than this, look at Tookie Williams. A murderer, gangster and all of the rest. A nasty piece of work when he went on trial and thoroughly deserving of a long prison sentence. While waiting on death row, he not only repents but goes about actively trying to undo the wrongs of his past, writing books against gangsterism etc. Tookie Williams on the day of his death was a benefit to society. But he was still executed. Why?

He was executed because he broke the law, and death was his penalty. Are you saying he should have been set free because he says he's sorry? That's a legal precedent that you don't want to start. Why? Because then everyone who commits a crime will have to be set free on the basis of "I'm sorry. I repented and should be forgiven for my crime, no matter how heinous."

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
A lot of murderers commit their crime when they're young. So they go to jail where they miss their best years, they have to live with dangerous people...

(I'm not dismissing the last portion - just leaving it out.) So what? If they screw up young, they miss the best years. Nobody complains when a retired person commits a crime and then misses retirement because they are incarcerated. Too bad. If you screw up, you pay. Doesn't matter when you screw up.

And it's not like they don't know what will happen to them if they break the law. We aren't hiding the consequences from these people.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
They won't get out until they're at least middle aged, by which time they'll have missed the chance to either have a family or see it grow up.

They shouldn't have broke the law, then. Boo fricking hoo.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
Long stretches in prison aren't simply opportunities to have a laugh with some bad boys, have fun escape ruses and educate yourself and work out a lot. They define the life of the prisoner.

Again, boo hoo. My heart bleeds peanut butter and jelly sandwiches for guys that fuck up and have to spend their entire lives behind bars. Someone call the wahmbulance.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
That's punishment enough, especially given the fact that death itself is a serious consideration for prisoners; look at prison suicide rates.

IMHO, not punishment enough. Bring back chain gangs. Put them to work. Enough lazing around smoking and doing push ups.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 07:38 AM) [snapback]1403999[/snapback]
I agree there is a good case for capital punishment, but if you weigh up the facts then it's a really unworkable policy. It is morally and ethically unacceptable.

You contradict yourself here. First there's a case for it, then you're against it. Which side of that fence did you say you were on?

You seem to have complete missed the point. What if they didn't break the law?

If they are dead, you can't go oh shit sorry about that, you can go now.
gingergenius
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 1 2008, 07:02 PM) [snapback]1404129[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 1 2008, 12:41 PM) [snapback]1404110[/snapback]
Get some rhetorical skill.

You've spent time here going through my argument and analysing it. Good boy. Unfortunately you waste your time by being black & white (I never said you had to release Tookie Williams, just not to execute him); being presumptuous (by assuming me saying life imprisonment was a bad punishment means I think they're being punished too harshly); and then by being black and white again (there can be a good case for an argument without it being correct).

Apart from that, I'd challenge you to go to a prison and see how you like it. What with prison gangs, sexually frustrated men, a high concentration of people with few moral scruples and psychiatric problems, and all the rest I'm sure you'd love it. If you get a life sentence then you're looking at the majority of your life in a hellish environment. The only point in life is to enjoy yourself and make the most of it; if you've got the rest of your life being bullied, abused etc. then you might like to end it a bit sooner than it would anyway and spare yourself some pain...

When it comes to punishment for breaking the law, it can only ever be black and white. You either accept your sentence or you don't. I am not saying that prisoners have to accept what they are in for in the prison system. I am only stating that they broke the law, they received a sentence, and like it or not they have to serve it. Even if that means being put to death.

Would I like prison? Hell no. I don't need to go to one to know it would suck. But if people don't want to go to prison, then they shouldn't fuck up. It's that simple. Don't fuck up and you won't go to prison. We aren't hiding the consequences from people. You know what happens if you kill someone. You go to jail, and in some states you face the silver, hollow sliver. People know that. If they don't want to face a life of abuse, bullies, etc., then don't kill/rob/torture/etc. someone.

As far as someone repenting and not having to die - did they think about that BEFORE they took someone else's life? Did Tookie, before he killed an innocent person, think "Geez - this person doesn't deserve to die. Maybe I shouldn't do this"? Probably not. If he had, then he wouldn't have killed this person. But he killed. And repenting won't get you anywhere with the state - especially if you show no remorse during your trial. And the jury saw fit to sentence him to death for his crimes. The fact that he repented and said he was sorry doesn't lessen his sentence, or take away from what he did. His punishment in this case was death. If he didn't like it, he could have gone through the proper appeals and such in an attempt to have his sentence reduced.

Again, by your logic someone who gets sentenced should be let off early and easy for saying "Oops - I made a mistake. Forgive me?". You're barking up the wrong tree with that argument, gigi. Let's put this into a perspective that you understand: Say, for example, YOU shoplifted something. (I'm not saying you did, this is a hypothetical situation). You get caught, and you are sentenced to 40 hours of community service. And your community service (you find out later) happens to be something that you absolutely hate and will scar you if you are forced to do it (I don't know what that is, so pick something you can't stand to do). At the same time, someone you know gets busted for shoplifting and gets 40 hours of community service. But this person says they are sorry, and that they should be forgiven, so they get let off with only doing 5 hours. Pissed yet? Cuz you would be seeing as you both got the same sentence for the same crime, but one of you got off early for saying "My bad!". Now apply this same logic to prisoners on death row.

Would you be willing to set that legal precedent? Would you be willing to look one prisoner in the eye and tell them their sentence is reduced for saying sorry, knowing full well that every prisoner out there in America (or wherever) will now be asking to be set free early because they are sorry too? Once you set the precedent, you can't take it back. Every prisoner now gets to go free for saying they were wrong.

Thoughts?


you've described exactly how the system (in the UK) works. ever heard the phrase 'let out early for good behaviour'?

anyway, it isn't the jury who decides the sentence. The jury's job is to decide whether the defendant is guilty or not guilty. The judge then decides on the sentence. In the UK, the judge applies statute law, preceding cases and his own judgement to decide on the length of the sentence of the guilty defendant. Judges are expected to make their decision in good faith, and showing remorse will get you a long way towards a reduced sentence. Think about it. You're a judge, you've got 2 youths both on trial for murdering someone. One, during the trial, is difficult, arrogant and shows no remorse of his actions. Another is quiet and looks genuinely remorseful of his actions. They're both convicted as guilty. The judge will nearly always give the arrogant youth a harsher punishment than the remorseful one. That's why if you plead guilty straightaway then you'll get a reduced sentence to if you had pleaded not guilty.

you may not like it, but I'm quite happy with the way the UK system works. The defendant has the right to trial by his peers. That's the jury. If they decide he's guilty, the judge, a man chosen because of his experience and wisdom, is free to sentence the defendant within the Law, and based on preceding legal cases, common law etc.

and there's a difference between saying sorry and actually meaning it. It's up to the judge to decide whether the defendant actually means it.
psychÝ
Wait, here a thing, if I kidnap someone in say Texas where the death penalty is allowed (but I assume not for kidnapping) and then drive to Arkansas and kill them which laws apply to which, could I be tried for murder in Texas or could I only be tried for kidnapping in Texas.

QUOTE
you've described exactly how the system (in the UK) works. ever heard the phrase 'let out early for good behaviour'
The only reason the UK system works that way is because there isn't enough prisons, it is a crap system, if they behave let them out their cell for an extra half hour a day, don't let them out all together.
Severus Snape
QUOTE
You seem to have complete missed the point. What if they didn't break the law?
psycho: Re-read my post. Mistakes are going to be made. It happens. But you cannot disregard the punishments just because you are afraid that a mistake is going to be made. I agree that it's a terrible thing when a truly innocent person gets put to death for a crime they didn't commit. But that shouldn't stop our judicial system from punishing criminals within the extent of the law.

QUOTE
Wait, here a thing, if I kidnap someone in say Texas where the death penalty is allowed (but I assume not for kidnapping) and then drive to Arkansas and kill them which laws apply to which, could I be tried for murder in Texas or could I only be tried for kidnapping in Texas.

psycho: I'm not a lawyer, but I believe you'd be tried for both crimes in Texas, and only the murder in Arkansas. But I'm guessing here, so don't take that as gospel.

QUOTE
you may not like it, but I'm quite happy with the way the UK system works. The defendant has the right to trial by his peers. That's the jury. If they decide he's guilty, the judge, a man chosen because of his experience and wisdom, is free to sentence the defendant within the Law, and based on preceding legal cases, common law etc.

GG: You just contradicted yourself here. First you state that people should be let off early for saying they are sorry, but now you are defending the judicial system for punishing criminals within the extent of the law. You are adamant that Tookie shouldn't have been put to death, but he was sentenced and punished within the extent of the law. You can't have this both ways. Pick a side and go with it.
FailSafe
I agree with Psycho on one point ever heard of the story "let him have it", that was a total misunderstanding of words which ended up getting an innocent man hung. And i dont think mistakes should be made because thats someones life you end and everyone has a chance to life.
Severus Snape
QUOTE(FailSafe @ Apr 2 2008, 08:38 AM) [snapback]1404525[/snapback]
I agree with Psycho on one point ever heard of the story "let him have it", that was a total misunderstanding of words which ended up getting an innocent man hung. And i dont think mistakes should be made because thats someones life you end and everyone has a chance to life.

That's what the appeals courts are for. Whether you're innocent or not, you have the option and opportunity to appeal your case before your execution. If you aren't taking advantage of that, then you deserve to be in jail.

Now, I have a couple things I would like to point out:

1. Not one person in here has asked "Well, what if they set a killer free?". Happens all the time. Someone really is guilty and the courts or the cops or whomever screws up and that person goes free. Nobody seems to think that's a major deal.
2. In the state of Wisconsin, we have had 2 of the biggest names in crime in our own backyard, and we don't have the death penalty. Jeffrey Dahmer and Ed Gein. But no death penalty? Please.
3. Also in Wisconsin, Steven Avery was in jail for a crime he didn't commit. He was eventually set free based on DNA evidence. He then KILLED an innocent woman for no apparent reason within 2 years of his release. How about that? An innocent man jailed, then freed, and then he commits a crime. How wonderful.

See, there are always going to be mistakes made no matter what. And mistakes are going to happen both ways. But again, you cannot stop punishing people for the fear that a mistake will be made. Thinking like that will only lead to another Dark Ages period.
Austin
only for extreme cases where there is not a shred of doubt that they committed it.. moors murders would be my definition of extreme.
psychÝ
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 2 2008, 12:58 PM) [snapback]1404502[/snapback]
QUOTE
You seem to have complete missed the point. What if they didn't break the law?
psycho: Re-read my post.
No, I read your post I presumed it was a mistake.

QUOTE
Mistakes are going to be made. It happens.
So you really are saying you would rather kill innocent people just to make sure you get the ones that actually did it.

QUOTE
QUOTE
Wait, here a thing, if I kidnap someone in say Texas where the death penalty is allowed (but I assume not for kidnapping) and then drive to Arkansas and kill them which laws apply to which, could I be tried for murder in Texas or could I only be tried for kidnapping in Texas.

psycho: I'm not a lawyer, but I believe you'd be tried for both crimes in Texas, and only the murder in Arkansas. But I'm guessing here, so don't take that as gospel.
Interesting, seems logical but surely that could get you off the death penalty, not really relevant but interesting.

QUOTE
QUOTE
you may not like it, but I'm quite happy with the way the UK system works. The defendant has the right to trial by his peers. That's the jury. If they decide he's guilty, the judge, a man chosen because of his experience and wisdom, is free to sentence the defendant within the Law, and based on preceding legal cases, common law etc.

GG: You just contradicted yourself here. First you state that people should be let off early for saying they are sorry, but now you are defending the judicial system for punishing criminals within the extent of the law.

That isn't a contradiction he is saying people should be given the sentence, but if they have some miraculous long term change in mind then that sentence maybe altered.
Severus Snape
QUOTE
So you really are saying you would rather kill innocent people just to make sure you get the ones that actually did it.
No. I am just saying that mistakes happen. I would rather not kill innocent people, but unfortunately it happens. The only way to completely prevent innocent people from being killed by the death penalty is to abolish the death penalty. But I can't condone that course of action.

QUOTE
That isn't a contradiction he is saying people should be given the sentence, but if they have some miraculous long term change in mind then that sentence maybe altered.

Sounded like a contradiction to me, but thanks for clarifying what was meant. But even your clarification gives credence to a statement I made earlier about the appeals process. Everyone in the prison system has the option and opportunity to appeal the decision made on their case, which includes appealing the sentencing. Does the appeals process always work? No. But then again, the initial trial doesn't work all the time either.
Sharpie Fetish
Why did they still execute tookie williams ? Because he'd already fucking done it

There are 1 or 2 reasons he wrote those books and w/e
1. to save his own skin and try to get him out of being executed
2. Because he recognised he had done bad and wanted to keep kids who could do that shit off it

Either way both reasons still mean Hes done it and should be punished
gingergenius
QUOTE(Recruit CyanTist @ Apr 2 2008, 06:46 PM) [snapback]1404602[/snapback]
Why did they still execute tookie williams ? Because he'd already fucking done it

There are 1 or 2 reasons he wrote those books and w/e
1. to save his own skin and try to get him out of being executed
2. Because he recognised he had done bad and wanted to keep kids who could do that shit off it

Either way both reasons still mean Hes done it and should be punished


Punished, yes. Killed, no.
Sharpie Fetish
By punished i ment killed He had still done it

perhaps upon hearing he was set for execution he may have done the first option

Its like never being a believer to a religion and then praying like hell on your deathbed

[NOTABIBLEBASHERTAKENFROMSIMPSONSMOVIE]
psychÝ
QUOTE(Recruit CyanTist @ Apr 2 2008, 07:18 PM) [snapback]1404618[/snapback]
Its like never being a believer to a religion and then praying like hell on your deathbed

Might as well cover all your bases.
Samurai_tbag
Personally, I'd rather see the criminal rot in prison for years. True retribution.
Severus Snape
QUOTE(Samurai_tbag @ Apr 2 2008, 04:29 PM) [snapback]1404722[/snapback]
Personally, I'd rather see the criminal rot in prison for years. True retribution.

So, in essence, you'd rather pay taxes to have some lowlife murderous scumbag sit in prison getting better treatment than the homeless, when in fact he should be put to death for his heinous crimes?
gingergenius
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 3 2008, 12:56 PM) [snapback]1404871[/snapback]
QUOTE(Samurai_tbag @ Apr 2 2008, 04:29 PM) [snapback]1404722[/snapback]
Personally, I'd rather see the criminal rot in prison for years. True retribution.

So, in essence, you'd rather pay taxes to have some lowlife murderous scumbag sit in prison getting better treatment than the homeless, when in fact he should be put to death for his heinous crimes?


There's no fact about it.

There's also the chance that the prisoner can actually do something worthwhile that homeless people don't do. Sewing up mailbags, license plates, and so on.

Can't you see the hypocrisy of your argument?

There's one thing that I'm surprised by... if murder is such heinous crime, why do you advocate the murder of a guy on death row? Like his victim he doesn't want to die, and it's being done against his will. All killing is wrong.
Ulster_Niko
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 01:39 PM) [snapback]1404885[/snapback]
All killing is wrong.


That's a bit of a sweeping generalisation, don't you think? I'm sure most people would hang Osama Bin-Laden if he is ever caught, for example. Punishment should befit the crime, I'm not saying the death penalty shoud be used indiscriminately: but for the worst of crimes it's definately worth consideration.
Severus Snape
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 07:39 AM) [snapback]1404885[/snapback]
There's also the chance that the prisoner can actually do something worthwhile that homeless people don't do. Sewing up mailbags, license plates, and so on.

If the prisoner were such a model citizen he/she wouldn't be in prison. Yes, they do work. But have you thought that maybe a homeless person doesn't have a job because they can't find one? Don't give me the "they should look harder" argument. Everyone knows that big businesses are being given tax breaks for outsourcing jobs to other countries. Tough to find a job when none exist.

And again, this goes to my statement about prison not being tough enough. They actually pay these guys who are working. They get food, shelter, exercise, and a paying job. Nice way to punish our killers.

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 07:39 AM) [snapback]1404885[/snapback]
Can't you see the hypocrisy of your argument?

Where's the hypocrisy in wanting to punish criminals?

QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 07:39 AM) [snapback]1404885[/snapback]
There's one thing that I'm surprised by... if murder is such heinous crime, why do you advocate the murder of a guy on death row? Like his victim he doesn't want to die, and it's being done against his will. All killing is wrong.

Spare us the bleeding heart liberal bullshit. Ask yourself this one question: If your only child was brutally killed by some lowlife for no reason, would you be able to forgive that person enough to not want them to face the death penalty?
gingergenius
QUOTE(Ulster_Niko @ Apr 3 2008, 02:26 PM) [snapback]1404897[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 01:39 PM) [snapback]1404885[/snapback]
All killing is wrong.


That's a bit of a sweeping generalisation, don't you think? I'm sure most people would hang Osama Bin-Laden if he is ever caught, for example. Punishment should befit the crime, I'm not saying the death penalty shoud be used indiscriminately: but for the worst of crimes it's definately worth consideration.


I wouldn't hang Osama bin Laden.

There is one thing that all humans have in common, from birth right up to the second before they die - they are alive. This is the most basic fact of human existence. The right to life is given to you by the fact that you are human. No one has the right to take this away.

A murderer has a motive to kill. He kills.

The US states of Texas, California etc. and elsewhere that practices capital punishment also have a motive to kill the murderer. They kill too.

Where's the difference? The hypocrisy in your argument, AA, is that you advocate the killing of a human as a suitable punishment for someone who has killed a human.
Severus Snape
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 12:48 PM) [snapback]1404995[/snapback]
Where's the difference? The hypocrisy in your argument, AA, is that you advocate the killing of a human as a suitable punishment for someone who has killed a human.

As opposed to your argument, which is basically to give them a medal and put them in a minimum security day spa like Martha Stewart. Again, spare us the liberal bleeding heart bullshit.

I won't argue that taking a life is wrong. But how are we to punish those that have killed? By giving them food, shelter, exercise, and a paying job? On our tax dollars? That is not an acceptable form of punishment. And let's not forget that there are some people so vile, so evil and vicious, that the death penalty is the only way to stop them from killing again and again. Or would you rather these serial killers live free in society?
Samurai_tbag
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 3 2008, 12:56 PM) [snapback]1404871[/snapback]
QUOTE(Samurai_tbag @ Apr 2 2008, 04:29 PM) [snapback]1404722[/snapback]
Personally, I'd rather see the criminal rot in prison for years. True retribution.

So, in essence, you'd rather pay taxes to have some lowlife murderous scumbag sit in prison getting better treatment than the homeless, when in fact he should be put to death for his heinous crimes?

I don't care where my taxes go, they're not going to be lowered, if anything they'll just be put into another area (health services, schools, etc...).

Also, I don't use public services, so it wouldn't bother me if all my tax was going to incarcerating criminals, I'd rather see justice than more unemployed chavs living off the state.
gingergenius
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 3 2008, 07:04 PM) [snapback]1405000[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 12:48 PM) [snapback]1404995[/snapback]
Where's the difference? The hypocrisy in your argument, AA, is that you advocate the killing of a human as a suitable punishment for someone who has killed a human.

As opposed to your argument, which is basically to give them a medal and put them in a minimum security day spa like Martha Stewart. Again, spare us the liberal bleeding heart bullshit.

I won't argue that taking a life is wrong. But how are we to punish those that have killed? By giving them food, shelter, exercise, and a paying job? On our tax dollars? That is not an acceptable form of punishment. And let's not forget that there are some people so vile, so evil and vicious, that the death penalty is the only way to stop them from killing again and again. Or would you rather these serial killers live free in society?


what's wrong with you?

How are we to punish those who have killed? Put them in prison. That's what happens in civilised countries... The spend the rest of their lives in prison, which are horrible places, and it's a worthwhile punishment. You make it out like prison is the same as a youth hostel. It's not. Apart from what I said before, they're overcrowded and full of rats, disease etc. If you call giving them a bucket, a thin matress, shit food and a roof over their heads shelter then sobeit, but it's hardly living the high life.

If you agree that taking a life is wrong I can't see where you're going with this..
J-Mi
hang about, everyone is totally off topic!!
BIG FUCKING SPIDER
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 11:31 PM) [snapback]1405106[/snapback]
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 3 2008, 07:04 PM) [snapback]1405000[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 12:48 PM) [snapback]1404995[/snapback]
Where's the difference? The hypocrisy in your argument, AA, is that you advocate the killing of a human as a suitable punishment for someone who has killed a human.

As opposed to your argument, which is basically to give them a medal and put them in a minimum security day spa like Martha Stewart. Again, spare us the liberal bleeding heart bullshit.

I won't argue that taking a life is wrong. But how are we to punish those that have killed? By giving them food, shelter, exercise, and a paying job? On our tax dollars? That is not an acceptable form of punishment. And let's not forget that there are some people so vile, so evil and vicious, that the death penalty is the only way to stop them from killing again and again. Or would you rather these serial killers live free in society?


what's wrong with you?

How are we to punish those who have killed? Put them in prison. That's what happens in civilised countries... The spend the rest of their lives in prison, which are horrible places, and it's a worthwhile punishment. You make it out like prison is the same as a youth hostel. It's not. Apart from what I said before, they're overcrowded and full of rats, disease etc. If you call giving them a bucket, a thin matress, shit food and a roof over their heads shelter then sobeit, but it's hardly living the high life.

If you agree that taking a life is wrong I can't see where you're going with this..

Have you seen the British Prisons? Overcrowded, yes so how do they solve it? Put the Criminals bunched up together in a cell? No, they release one early to make room! For good behaviour they get SKY+, Playstations, Televisions Ect. These people are Rapists, murderers and they are getting to live the high life which some poor yet law abiding citizen cannot afford, it is total lunacy. These people are SCUM, and are rewarded to an extent for it!
gingergenius
QUOTE(BIG FUCKING SPIDER @ Apr 4 2008, 12:43 AM) [snapback]1405177[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 11:31 PM) [snapback]1405106[/snapback]
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 3 2008, 07:04 PM) [snapback]1405000[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 12:48 PM) [snapback]1404995[/snapback]
Where's the difference? The hypocrisy in your argument, AA, is that you advocate the killing of a human as a suitable punishment for someone who has killed a human.

As opposed to your argument, which is basically to give them a medal and put them in a minimum security day spa like Martha Stewart. Again, spare us the liberal bleeding heart bullshit.

I won't argue that taking a life is wrong. But how are we to punish those that have killed? By giving them food, shelter, exercise, and a paying job? On our tax dollars? That is not an acceptable form of punishment. And let's not forget that there are some people so vile, so evil and vicious, that the death penalty is the only way to stop them from killing again and again. Or would you rather these serial killers live free in society?


what's wrong with you?

How are we to punish those who have killed? Put them in prison. That's what happens in civilised countries... The spend the rest of their lives in prison, which are horrible places, and it's a worthwhile punishment. You make it out like prison is the same as a youth hostel. It's not. Apart from what I said before, they're overcrowded and full of rats, disease etc. If you call giving them a bucket, a thin matress, shit food and a roof over their heads shelter then sobeit, but it's hardly living the high life.

If you agree that taking a life is wrong I can't see where you're going with this..

Have you seen the British Prisons? Overcrowded, yes so how do they solve it? Put the Criminals bunched up together in a cell? No, they release one early to make room! For good behaviour they get SKY+, Playstations, Televisions Ect. These people are Rapists, murderers and they are getting to live the high life which some poor yet law abiding citizen cannot afford, it is total lunacy. These people are SCUM, and are rewarded to an extent for it!


If you got that from the daily mail then fine, believe everything you read. You really think murderers get released into nice big houses with Playstations? The ones who maybe do get released are the ones who have been convicted of robbery or more minor crimes; and the ones who appear to have reformed. Anyway, do you realise how hard it is for someone with previous to get a job? Far from living the high life, they'll do well not to be pushed back into a life of crime by poverty.
Severus Snape
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 4 2008, 03:24 AM) [snapback]1405364[/snapback]
Far from living the high life, they'll do well not to be pushed back into a life of crime by poverty.

This is the only sentence of yours that I feel compelled to respond to. You don't advocate using the death penalty, which is cool. But by your own admission here, criminals are more likely to commit another crime once they are released from prison. You release a killer, he is more likely to kill again. Stuffing these people into prisons that are already overcrowded is not the answer, and they don't belong on the street. So then what are we to do with them, gigi?
Skinny†
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 4 2008, 04:48 AM) [snapback]1404995[/snapback]
QUOTE(Ulster_Niko @ Apr 3 2008, 02:26 PM) [snapback]1404897[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 01:39 PM) [snapback]1404885[/snapback]
All killing is wrong.


That's a bit of a sweeping generalisation, don't you think? I'm sure most people would hang Osama Bin-Laden if he is ever caught, for example. Punishment should befit the crime, I'm not saying the death penalty shoud be used indiscriminately: but for the worst of crimes it's definately worth consideration.


I wouldn't hang Osama bin Laden.

There is one thing that all humans have in common, from birth right up to the second before they die - they are alive. This is the most basic fact of human existence. The right to life is given to you by the fact that you are human. No one has the right to take this away.

...and murders have taken this right from people, some have even tortured and raped them first. Fuck them, let them die. Why do you feel they deserve this right when they have taken it from other people?
gingergenius
QUOTE(Arch Angel @ Apr 4 2008, 12:56 PM) [snapback]1405425[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 4 2008, 03:24 AM) [snapback]1405364[/snapback]
Far from living the high life, they'll do well not to be pushed back into a life of crime by poverty.

This is the only sentence of yours that I feel compelled to respond to. You don't advocate using the death penalty, which is cool. But by your own admission here, criminals are more likely to commit another crime once they are released from prison. You release a killer, he is more likely to kill again. Stuffing these people into prisons that are already overcrowded is not the answer, and they don't belong on the street. So then what are we to do with them, gigi?


Why is putting them in prison not the answer? And when did I say they had to be released...

Skinny, an eye for an eye will make the world blind.
Skinny†
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 5 2008, 03:30 AM) [snapback]1405511[/snapback]
Skinny, an eye for an eye will make the world blind.

So you're proposing a punch in the arm for an eye?

You seemed pretty passionate about our right to be alive before, so tell me what you think should happen to people who take this right from others (murderers)?
Sharpie Fetish
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 11:31 PM) [snapback]1405106[/snapback]
The spend the rest of their lives in prison, which are horrible places, and it's a worthwhile punishment. .


Prison is horrible? Bullshit

They have fucking TVs in some prisons theyre given bleeding cocoa at night to 'help them sleep'

Prison is a cushy comfortable place Quite frankly some poeple offend to fucking have a easy life In there you pay no taxes and bills or anything of the sort you get Tvs fed and looked after generally

Living inside a prison is better than outside
psychÝ
QUOTE(Recruit CyanTist @ Apr 4 2008, 06:31 PM) [snapback]1405528[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 11:31 PM) [snapback]1405106[/snapback]
The spend the rest of their lives in prison, which are horrible places, and it's a worthwhile punishment. .

Living inside a prison is better than outside

Seriously what world do you live in, stop reading "The Sun" as calling it a newspaper is an insult to the industry, it has no news in it.

Yes, it maybe the best selling "newspaper" but that just proves something about this country.
gingergenius
QUOTE(Recruit CyanTist @ Apr 4 2008, 06:31 PM) [snapback]1405528[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 11:31 PM) [snapback]1405106[/snapback]
The spend the rest of their lives in prison, which are horrible places, and it's a worthwhile punishment. .


Prison is horrible? Bullshit

They have fucking TVs in some prisons theyre given bleeding cocoa at night to 'help them sleep'

Prison is a cushy comfortable place Quite frankly some poeple offend to fucking have a easy life In there you pay no taxes and bills or anything of the sort you get Tvs fed and looked after generally

Living inside a prison is better than outside


you're a mug you blatantly don't know anyone who's even spent a night in a police cell if you come spouting that shit.
Sharpie Fetish
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 4 2008, 07:34 PM) [snapback]1405541[/snapback]
QUOTE(Recruit CyanTist @ Apr 4 2008, 06:31 PM) [snapback]1405528[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 11:31 PM) [snapback]1405106[/snapback]
The spend the rest of their lives in prison, which are horrible places, and it's a worthwhile punishment. .


Prison is horrible? Bullshit

They have fucking TVs in some prisons theyre given bleeding cocoa at night to 'help them sleep'

Prison is a cushy comfortable place Quite frankly some poeple offend to fucking have a easy life In there you pay no taxes and bills or anything of the sort you get Tvs fed and looked after generally

Living inside a prison is better than outside


you're a mug you blatantly don't know anyone who's even spent a night in a police cell if you come spouting that shit.


Police cells are awful brick walls with bricks with a padded bit on top for a bed Prisons however arent
Hardcore Ottoman
Federal prison is better than State I've heard.
FuddMan
QUOTE(Recruit CyanTist @ Apr 4 2008, 06:31 PM) [snapback]1405528[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 11:31 PM) [snapback]1405106[/snapback]
The spend the rest of their lives in prison, which are horrible places, and it's a worthwhile punishment. .


Prison is horrible? Bullshit

They have fucking TVs in some prisons theyre given bleeding cocoa at night to 'help them sleep'

Prison is a cushy comfortable place Quite frankly some poeple offend to fucking have a easy life In there you pay no taxes and bills or anything of the sort you get Tvs fed and looked after generally

Living inside a prison is better than outside

What a load of crap. We had a guy who'd spent 21 years of his life in prison come talk to us at school the other week. He never liked it one bit, ever. You have to work your arse off to get luxuries like half an hour of TV time. Most cells were built for one person but have had a bunk bed put in so the two of you sleep and shit in the same 6ft of space. In the showers, bend down the wrong way and you'll offend someone, earning yourself a kicking. The toilet 'cubicles' don't have doors so everyone sees you taking a shit. If your cellmate doesn't like you, they'll give you a dirty pair of "rapist jeans", which tells the other guys to spit and throw their piss in your face, even if you aren't a rapist or a paedo. People always make weapons out of the supplies they get - tin of beef in a sock makes a good mace to crack skulls, and a snapped razor blade in the melted end of a toothbrush is great for a cut-open chest. If you end up in a cell where the previous inmate still owed a debt, you'll be the one who has to pay it back, which means bending over until you give them twice what they gave. Prison isn't nice at all. It's just how the media and TV programmes portrays it to make people think prisoners are getting an easy ride.
Skinny†
QUOTE(Recruit CyanTist @ Apr 5 2008, 04:31 AM) [snapback]1405528[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 11:31 PM) [snapback]1405106[/snapback]
The spend the rest of their lives in prison, which are horrible places, and it's a worthwhile punishment. .


Prison is horrible? Bullshit

They have fucking TVs in some prisons theyre given bleeding cocoa at night to 'help them sleep'

Prison is a cushy comfortable place Quite frankly some poeple offend to fucking have a easy life In there you pay no taxes and bills or anything of the sort you get Tvs fed and looked after generally

Living inside a prison is better than outside

Are you serious? You live in a 6 by 8 feet cell with another convicted criminal and share a fucking toilet right next to your bed. You would be lucky to get any TV time at all, I'm pretty sure you need to do some ridiculous chores to even get that and it's certainly not in your cell. Obviously you get fed but do you really think it tastes good? Do you think they are given a cheese pizza with a beer? It's slop with some sour milk.
Ryanardo
QUOTE(J-Mi @ Apr 1 2008, 05:46 AM) [snapback]1403926[/snapback]
This is my second topic before I go to work. Does anyone think they should bring back capital punishment in this country? Why?


Second topic before work, respect mate.

Think things should stay the way they are
Hardcore Ottoman
QUOTE(DuffMan @ Apr 4 2008, 06:03 PM) [snapback]1405624[/snapback]
QUOTE(Recruit CyanTist @ Apr 4 2008, 06:31 PM) [snapback]1405528[/snapback]
QUOTE(gingergenius @ Apr 3 2008, 11:31 PM) [snapback]1405106[/snapback]
The spend the rest of their lives in prison, which are horrible places, and it's a worthwhile punishment. .


Prison is horrible? Bullshit

They have fucking TVs in some prisons theyre given bleeding cocoa at night to 'help them sleep'

Prison is a cushy comfortable place Quite frankly some poeple offend to fucking have a easy life In there you pay no taxes and bills or anything of the sort you get Tvs fed and looked after generally

Living inside a prison is better than outside

What a load of crap. We had a guy who'd spent 21 years of his life in prison come talk to us at school the other week. He never liked it one bit, ever. You have to work your arse off to get luxuries like half an hour of TV time. Most cells were built for one person but have had a bunk bed put in so the two of you sleep and shit in the same 6ft of space. In the showers, bend down the wrong way and you'll offend someone, earning yourself a kicking. The toilet 'cubicles' don't have doors so everyone sees you taking a shit. If your cellmate doesn't like you, they'll give you a dirty pair of "rapist jeans", which tells the other guys to spit and throw their piss in your face, even if you aren't a rapist or a paedo. People always make weapons out of the supplies they get - tin of beef in a sock makes a good mace to crack skulls, and a snapped razor blade in the melted end of a toothbrush is great for a cut-open chest. If you end up in a cell where the previous inmate still owed a debt, you'll be the one who has to pay it back, which means bending over until you give them twice what they gave. Prison isn't nice at all. It's just how the media and TV programmes portrays it to make people think prisoners are getting an easy ride.

That is basically similar to juvenile perhaps in a greater dose, except for paying back debts for another guy because you don't stay in there long enough for that shit. And we don't get tins or razor blades (the blades because the time there isn't that long, I'm sure) but we get toothbrushes we have to give back each time after use.

I remember one funny threat someone told me: that he was going to rip out my braces making my gums bloody and then use them to slit my throat. Seemed really silly and ambitious so I didn't heed it. Nothing came of it. Maybe in actual prison it may have though...
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